Tuesday, 17 March 2009

The NHS Is Bad For Your Health

Tell anybody about Libertarian proposals to abolish Income Tax, they reach for the garlic and crosses, you bastards will ruin the wonderful NHS !

Sorry I had not realised that they were doing such a sterling job, and that a cull of 400 patients was part of the deal. Nor was leaving young men lying around for thirty hours after a rugby injury also a good plan, to the point that they kill themselves rather than live with the consequences of NHS neglect.

The Sacred Cow that is the NHS needs to be slaughtered. Saying that is going to get the same reaction from the left, the medical equivalent of racist.

Even Dr Sean Gabb of the Libertarian Alliance, has admitted that the British population are so wedded to the 'concept' of the NHS rather than the reality, that it is a no go area in politics.

If the State is going to maintain this edifice, it must not be a temple to filth, infection, delay and bureaucracy. The NI scheme, should become what it says it it is for, National Insurance, not funnelling money into general taxation, that is just dishonest.

Each hospital would be separated from the Behemoth of the State, and have elected management boards, NOT political appointees, with at last some management skills in running a complex organisation. If they fail they are sacked, and in extremis the Hospital closed.

The hospital would not receive any funds at all from the NI fund, if it is overburdened with accountants, the wards are filthy,and the mortality rate is unreasonable. Only efficient, clean hospitals will be allowed to survive.

The following would definately not be on the NHS- cosmetic surgery and obesity training. The NHS would be largely for emergency treatment,anything else can be for private clinics to deal with, and you would pay for.

The NHS having been treated as a sacred cow for so long is beyond reform in its current state, and is actively killing people on a daily basis.

You cannot run a Health provision on precepts laid down in the Butskillism of the 1950's


Goodnight Vienna said...

It makes sense Guthrum, but how would you manage the 'change-over'?

It's apparent that the the Welfare State has collapsed under its own weight but many have paid into the scheme for up to 40/50 years; what can be done to mitigate the effects of such a policy on our elderly?

The Penguin said...

I have on several occasions posted on how well the NHS is doing in killing 40,000 a year.

That Doctor Shipman knew how to exceed targets!

The Penguin

etzel said...

They've kept my old man going for 15 years. The private sector would've ditched him.

IanPJ said...

Goodnight Vienna, the premiums that you pay into the National Insurance scheme are valid only for 1 year.

It does not matter that you have contributed for 40 or 50 years, it is only the last years contributions that count towards your 'health care'.

It grows ever larger, is sucking a percentage out of your earnings, and it feeds and funds over 1,000 quango's that deliver virtually nothing, whilst starving the front line staff of the essentials to provide quality care.

It is a derelict behemoth that needs culling.

Guthrum said...


The Welfare State does not provide a 'living' pension for OAP's it was a lie then and a lie now, Brown has just finished the deal by destroying private pensions as well.

Geriatric medicine in this country is frankly appalling, the old, which is what you and I will become, are shuffled off to the 'home' to die without being a burden to their families- the State can take responsibility.

Hopefully you will not end up in a home where you risk, a beating, being murdered by the home owner, or despatched by the likes of Shipman.

It is not a matter of managing the transistion, but seizing ownership of the problem, from the 'caring' professions.

Anonymous said...

It might do a slightly better job if it didn't treat the rest of world for nothing. A couple of years ago I read that Labour had sent a memo to all hospitals stating that maternity patients must be treated no matter where they had come from. Followed shortly by a massive wave of flights landing in Heathrow from around the world for freebies.

Anonymous said...

Here we go again! Rich men wanting to save a few quid, fuck everyone else.

Do us a favour, take your "talents" and piss off abroad you'd be happier and so would I.

Old Holborn said...

It is a Ponzi scheme, simple as that.

I've used the German health care system for 12 years at half the price and twice as nice as that of the NHS.

I have also left instructions that if I fall seriously ill, my family are to drive me to the Universitätsklinikum Aachen and throw me at A&E

Old Holborn said...

Anon, fuck off, there's a good chap.

Anonymous said...

I've just had a procedure done in a private hospital. The NHS paid for it, but the surgeon doesn't do NHS surgery for a number of reasons:

His patients get infected. In a private hospital, C Diff, MRSA and E coli are very rare.

His patients aren't allowed to smoke 3 months before the op. Fucks up the post op healing. He can refuse you treatment, and he does. In the NHS he can't.

You also won't get the op if you don't agree to the specialist kit that supports your repair. It's not expensive; less than a week's wages and you can work out a payment plan. However, it keeps the scum off the list; which has the added bonus of keeping anaesthetic accidents down, as normal people don't do the drugs that react badly with GA.

Our surgery and medicine is the best in the world, and our delivery of it is a fucking disaster. Unless of course, like me, you're cunning, aggressive and charming.

Guthrum said...

Anon 15.23

If NuLab told you Scutari was the medical envy of the world you would believe it.

Tim Carpenter said...


All this is still under consideration, but here goes:

There are various ways to handle the change-over. You are most correct in identifying this as a big issue. To me, it is far harder than deciding the destination.

The important things to handle are the monopoly of State provision and what is called "the third party payer problem", which, in English, means that now the NHS does what the Government wants, not what the patient wants, even though the patient is the one who in truth pays.

You deal with the monopoly of provision by getting the State OUT of direct provision. This does not mean selling stuff off and "privatising", but unhooking the Hospitals from direct control and funding by SHAs and PCTs and making them independent trusts in their own right.

Hospitals will be free to cooperate with each other and share overheads, natch.

They will get paid like practically any other entity in the economy - for the work they do at a rate they can charge. The better and more efficient the hospital, the more money they can get. Dirty, inefficient? Shape up or ship out. We expect almost all hospitals will do the former.

As for the payer, we need to have what was proposed 60 years ago - health insurance. The money must follow the patient and the patient should not be locked into a provision apparatus decided by geography (i.e. SHA/PCT monopoly). If the patient can move their "stamps" from one provider to another, those providers will be damn sure to provide a good service and get access to the best hospitals or face closure.

Not sure if the best route is to allow SHAs and PCTs to lose their geographic monopoly over patients and grip over the hospitals to offer their own policies in competition to private companies or not. Some say the SHAs and PCTs are just so utterly inefficient and incompetent they would not stand a chance.

In terms of the insurance polices, I think the Swiss have a good idea to demand all providers offer the same premium for each product, regardless of the patient, but can offer top up products and compete on price. In Switzerland, the basic package is considered better than a good private German or US policy.

Tim Carpenter said...

BTW, in the SHA/PCT monopoly, the options are to a) lose their geo monopoly or b) shut them down.

AntiCitizenOne said...

Remember NHS specs?

Think of the improvaements to health care if it wasn't rationed by the state like it was before Specsavers etc.

We need a LifeSavers and we need it fast. The NHS is a fucking disaster.

BTW you might like "my" blog National Death Service

cesars wife said...

my last encounter with NHS management ended in a WTF moment , i was given a diary appointment for 1 years time and told to keep it safe.

when i enquired that it would be better to inform the patient nearer the date , i was given some speil about missing appointments costs the NHS money.

on the whole its good to be able to have excellent medical services , but the NHS does not understand cost base , and we have the ludicrous system of public private doctors and very expensive temp skills contracts.

the issue is complex , the goverment goes on about smoking, drinking being fat , and they promote lifestyles that encourage this , so creating more cost .

they should put it back to county , make the county collect , health plan reciepts , cap salaries , switch to contribution pension scheme , and the thing should run better.

national government should only run medical training/standards and drug certification.

soon get the efficencies to get the cost down and enable re investement.

the basic problem is they say we need the money , and they get it without having to make any efficencies , it just keeps on ballooning in line with people being led to believe they need more health care.

and the lobbyests just become like sales people to get ideas taken up.

the creit crunch will bring around many painfull things, one of which will be the need for the nhs to cut costs .

thanks gordon

Old Holborn said...


Good job

Anonymous said...

Shocking footage of Labour party spokesman questioned on Iraq


Anonymous said...

check this poor bloke out.
Paul Steane.

Commie Biscuits said...

Point your finger at the grubby fingers of common purpose and its staph. Bureaucracy has crept in and found a home in the festering corners of hospitals up and down the country.

Who was it that proclaimed that the use of bleach/disinfectant should be done with? What is going on here?

Having surgery performed in an NHS hospital is akin to having the dentist scale your teeth with a shitty stick - I want to know who told the dentist to use the shitty stick.

Anonymous said...

Shocking footage of Labour party spokesman questioned on Iraq

The only thing that's shocking about that video is that over 50% of the time is taken up by the title sequence. In all other respects, it is totally mundane.

it's either banned or compulsory said...

At least some of the senior managers at North Staffs had the grace to resign.
Flog the NHS off, preferably to Tesco who seem to manage logistics and Human Resources rather better.

Goodnight Vienna said...

Thanks for your answers to a tricky problem - Tim's given me something to think about. The NHS definitely needs radical re-structuring and, considering the mess it's now in, I'm not so sure it's still the 'sacred cow' it once was.

Anonymous said...

Anonymous said...
Shocking footage of Labour party spokesman questioned on Iraq

The only thing that's shocking about that video is that over 50% of the time is taken up by the title sequence. In all other respects, it is totally mundane.

18 March 2009 01:54

You don't think it is shocking that someone canvassing for the Labour party has no comment on a majore and deadly Labour - and Conservative party policy?

What is truly shocking that you are so glib.

Back to Eastenders with yer!

Tristan said...

Anon @15:23

Well, I'm not particularly rich, but I want to do away with the NHS.
Why? Mainly because it harms the poor far more than the rich.
The value of the taxes stolen from the poor to the poor to pay for 3rd class treatment is far greater than for the rich.
The poor suffer because thanks to the state they have no option but to put their fate in the hands of the NHS rather than have the opportunity to choose the health care they wish.
After the founding of the welfare state, the state systematically destroyed the voluntary organisations which supplied services to the poor, services which would have been even better if the state did not act to protect the plutocrats, landlords and capitalists from the free market...

David Murphy said...

It's saying to the elderly - "We've had your money - now F.O." The standard of care and provision to the elderly in the UK ranging from means tested benefit subsitute for a decent state pension, to criminal community care home visits (soon to be cut from an hour to 45 minutes - what is that in terms of caring for an elderly person on a visit?) and equally criminal residential care conditions, etc Still most OAPs vote Tory so that section deserve what they get.

David Murphy said...

Very very wrong. The tories voted against every Beveridge Bill and legislationto set up the NHS - and YOU think rettispectively they did that to protect the poor working classes? Get a brain.

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